Chapter 8: Men vs Women Tolerance for Physical Pain

In the beginning of chapter 8 there is a short paragraph of Holden describing how he feels after the fight with Stradlater. Later, he moves on to talk about his experience being on the train with his classmates mother. Although, the beginning paragraph grabbed me. Why did he only talk about his pain for ONE short paragraph? Did it even hurt him? I know if I got punched by a guy who is supposed to be an athlete, I would have a mouthful to tell everyone about it. Thats when I thought, Do women or men have a higher tolerance for pain?

Here is the short paragraph I mentioned:

“It was too late to call up for a cab or anything, so I walked the whole way to the station. It wasn’t too far, but it was cold as hell, and the snow made it hard for walking, and my Gladstones kept banging hell out of my legs. I sort of enjoyed the air and all, though. The only trouble was, the cold made my nose hurt, and right under my upper lip, where old Stradlater’d laid one on me. He’d smacked my lip right on my teeth, and it was pretty sore. My ears were nice and warm, though. That hat I bought had earlaps in it, and I put them on–I didn’t give a damn how I looked. Nobody was around anyway. Everybody was in the sack. ” (30)

From this, I gathered a couple of things.

1.  The cold made his nose and his upper lip hurt more.

2. Those are the places Stradlater hit him at

3. His lip is sore from being hit on his teeth.

4. He admits this particular spot  “pretty sore”.

5. He finds relief in the warm earlaps.

20130418_Couple-Puching-Boxing

This intrigues me. If I had gotten hit, I would have hurt a little bit more than what he describes.  After a little research, here is what I found:

“…overall, women were more likely to indicate higher pain levels than men, says lead author Dr. Atul Butte, chief of systems medicine in the department of pediatrics at Stanford University School of Medicine. And that was true across almost all of the different diseases. ” I was a little surprised when I read this. I always thought women were tougher. 😉

“What accounts for the gender gap? Hormones may explain some of the difference — studies have shown that estrogen in women can help dampen the activity of pain receptors, helping them to tolerate higher levels of pain. That means, however, that they may become more sensitive to pain during low-estrogen parts of the menstrual cycle.” This explains a little bit why the level of pain may vary in women.

But still, why was Holden so nonchalant about his injuries?

“There may also be explanations that have nothing to do with biology. Men, for example, may feel compelled by cultural stereotypes to be tough, and therefore report feeling less pain than they really do —especially when asked by the mostly female nursing staff.”

It looks like the psychologist that Holden was speaking to may have been a woman and he wanted to sound a little tougher. This makes sense to me, boys may say they aren’t in a lot of pain to protect their egos.

Read more.

Photo: http://www.projectup.net/blog/images/stories/20130418_Couple-Puching-Boxing.jpg by Bryan Yao

Vote on a Poll to see what others think, Do Men or Women tolerate pain better?:

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Tales of Brave Ulysses, Cream by Thomas Sellers

In the book The Odyssey the reader is brought through the tale of Odyssey and his journey. Early in the book the reader can see Odysseus being seduced by the famous nymph Calypso. She is so powerful that he is described as being “held captive”(pg. 152    I think the theme from this song can be depicted for the power of women, and their effects on men.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u8hLc_nqx8g

We see Odysseus here basically lifeless when hearing the singing, “how his naked ears were tortured”, we can see that the bard knows that the interaction with her is bad, but when he describes his ears as being naked. It tells that he is helpless to her seduction, and it leads to proving my point even more.

____________________________________________________

Lyrics courtesy of http://www.lyricsfreak.com

 

You thought the leaden winter would bring you down forever, 
But you rode upon a steamer to the violence of the sun. 
And the colours of the sea bind your eyes with trembling mermaids, 
And you touch the distant beaches with tales of brave Ulysses, 
How his naked ears were tortured by the sirens sweetly singing, 
For the sparkling waves are calling you to kiss their white laced lips. 
And you see a girl’s brown body dancing through the turquoise, 
And her footprints make you follow where the sky loves the sea. 
And when your fingers find her, she drowns you in her body, 
Carving deep blue ripples in the tissues of your mind. 
The tiny purple fishes run laughing through your fingers, 
And you want to take her with you to the hard land of the winter. 
Her name is Aphrodite and she rides a crimson shell, 
And you know you cannot leave her for you touched the distant sands 
With tales of brave Ulysses, how his naked ears were tortured 
By the sirens sweetly singing. 
The tiny purple fishes run lauging through your fingers, 
And you want to take her with you to the hard land of the winter. 

[Live Cream Vol 2:] 
Well You thought the leaden winter would bring you down forever, 
But you rode upon a steamer to the violence of the sun. 
And the colours of the sea bind your eyes with trembling mermaids, 
And you touch the distant beaches with tales of brave Ulysses, 
How his naked ears were tortured by the sirens sweetly singin’, 
Sparkling waves are calling you to touch a white laced lip. 
You see your girl’s brown body dancing through the turquoise, 
And her footprints make you follow where the sky loves the sea. 
And when your fingers find her, she drowns you in her body, 
Carving deep blue ripples in the tissues of your mind. 
Tiny purple fishes run laughing to your finger, 
You want to take her with you to the hard land of the winter. 
Her name is Aphrodite and she rides a crimson shell, 
You know you cannot leave her for you touched the distant sands 
With tales of brave Ulysses, how his naked ears were tortured 
By the sirens sweetly singing. 
Tiny purple fishes run lauging through your fingers, 
You want to take her with you to the hard land of the winter. 

Carry on Wayward Son

Carry on Wayward Son – by Kansas

Carry on Wayward Son, by Kansas, represents the Odyssey by relating a common theme of a long and treacherous journey. In both this song and the Odyssey, people speak of a long and tiring journey by ship across stormy seas.The song reveals that the hero has hope that he will reach home as he hears voices telling him that he should venture on and there will be peace when he reaches home. The goal of the song and the Odyssey are very similar because they both illustrate that the main goal is reaching home and being at rest after such a long journey. The tragic flaw of the character in this song is that he sees himself as a blind or mad man because he flew too high or ventured too far. The image of a hero in this song is an unlikely hero of someone who had hope and wishes to go home, but, against great odds, finally reaches home. The mood of the song is hopeful and insinuates a trial is going on in order to reach a goal. The guitar, drums, and piano are used to make the song more upbeat and lively. The song is very encouraging and inspiring. I might also add that it is a song we play in band to encourage the football team at games.

Once I rose above the noise and confusion

Just to get a glimpse beyond this illusion

I was soaring ever higher, but I flew too high

Though my eyes could see I still was a blind man

Though my mind could think I still was a mad man

I hear the voices when I’m dreamin’, I can hear them say

Carry on, my wayward son

For there’ll be peace when you are done

Lay your weary head to rest

Don’t you cry no more

Masquerading as a man with a reason

My charade is the event of the season

And if I claim to be a wise man, it surely means that I don’t know

On a stormy sea of moving emotion

Tossed about I’m like a ship on the ocean

I set a course for winds of fortune, but I hear the voices say

Carry on, my wayward son

There’ll be peace when you are done

Lay your weary head to rest

Don’t you cry no more

Carry on, you will always remember

Carry on, nothing equals the splendor

Now your life’s no longer empty

Surely heaven waits for you

Carry on, my wayward son

There’ll be peace when you are done

Lay your weary head to rest

Don’t you cry (don’t you cry no more)

Home At Last

By: Carlton Smith and Cole Mitchell

The song Home At Last by Steely Dan  relates to The Odyssey in many different ways. The song mentions the phrase “the danger on the rocks has surely passed”, Odysseus had some trouble with rocks in the story but I think that the line could also refer to how Odysseus  has finished the fight in Troy. The next lint says “still I remain tied to the mast” and we believe that this could represent Odysseus not being able to return home easily. The songs tone makes you stress relieved as if you have just made it back from a long and vigorous journey. It could almost foreshadow Odysseus’ return but there is still struggle there.

I know this super highway

This bright familiar sun

I guess that I’m the lucky one

Who wrote that tired sea song

Set on this peaceful shore

You think you’ve heard this one before

 

Well the danger on the rocks is surely past

Still I remain tied to the mast

Could it be that I have found my home at last

Home at last

 

She serves the smooth retsina

She keeps me safe and warm

It’s just the calm before the storm

Call in my reservation

So long hey thanks my friend

I guess I’ll try my luck again

 

Well the danger on the rocks is surely past

Still I remain tied to the mast

Could it be that I have found my home at last

Home at last

 Steely Dan | Home At Last

Drops of Jupiter by Lexie Heim

Lyrics:                                                                                “Drops Of Jupiter”

 

Now that she’s back in the atmosphere

With drops of Jupiter in her hair, hey, hey, hey

She acts like summer and walks like rain

Reminds me that there’s a time to change, hey, hey, hey

Since the return from her stay on the moon

She listens like spring and she talks like June, hey, hey, hey

Hey, hey, hey

 

But tell me, did you sail across the sun?

Did you make it to the Milky Way to see the lights all faded

And that heaven is overrated?

 

Tell me, did you fall for a shooting star –

One without a permanent scar?

And did you miss me while you were looking for yourself out there?

 

Now that she’s back from that soul vacation

Tracing her way through the constellation, hey, hey, hey (Mmm)

She checks out Mozart while she does tae-bo

Reminds me that there’s room to grow, hey, hey, hey (Yeah)

 

Now that she’s back in the atmosphere

I’m afraid that she might think of me as plain ol’ Jane

Told a story about a man who was too afraid to fly so he never leave land

 

But tell me, did the wind sweep you off your feet?

Did you finally get the chance to dance along the light of day

And head back to the Milky Way?

And tell me, did Venus blow your mind?

Was it everything you wanted to find?

And did you miss me while you were looking for yourself out there?

 

Can you imagine no love, pride, deep-fried chicken?

Your best friend always sticking up for you even when I know you’re wrong

Can you imagine no first dance, freeze dried romance, five-hour phone conversation?

The best soy latte that you ever had and me

 

But tell me, did the wind sweep you off your feet?

Did you finally get the chance to dance along the light of day

And head back toward the Milky Way?

 

Na, na, na, na, na, na, na, na, na, na, na, na

 

But tell me, did you sail across the sun?

Did you make it to the Milky Way to see the lights all faded

And that heaven is overrated?

 

Na, na, na, na, na, na, na, na, na, na, na

 

But tell me, did you fall for a shooting star,

One without a permanent scar?

And did you miss me while you were looking for yourself?

 

Na, na, na, na, na, na, na, na, na, na, na

 

And did you finally get the chance to dance along the light of day?

Na na na na na na na na na na na na na na

And did you fall for a shooting star, fall for a shooting star?

Na na na na na na na na na na na na na na

And are you lonely looking for yourself out there?

 

credits: “Drops of Jupiter Lyrics”  http://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/train/dropsofjupiter.html, 2000-2013 AZLyrics.com


Analyisis- In Drops of Jupiter by Train, the song describes a girl going on a soul-journey where she metaphorically travels through space in order to find herself, and that is what we would be considered her odyssey. This song relates to Homer’s The Odyssey because in both stories, people leave and come back changed.

This song is part of the hero archetype that not only the Odyssey follows (both Odysseus and Telemachus) but also in this song because this girl that Train is describing has gone on her journey, and she has come back a different person which is an example of “return home” on the hero archetypal cycle.

The story and the song both have similar goals in which the characters are both protean people who overcome either an emotional or physical obstacle, which leaves them a different person as described before. Another good idea that The Odyssey and Drops of Jupiter are similar is because they both contain epic similes. An epic simile is a simile that extends longer than an avergae one sentence simile, and it is usually in a poem or a novel. In the song, you can see that Train is relating the character’s journey to the moon, venus, and the milky way throughout the whole song, which makes a natural epic simile because the character of Train’s song is not actually out in space. The Odyssey relates to this in which it contains numerous epic similes.

for example, “Odysseus turned his face toward the radiant sun, anxious for it to set, yearning now to be gone and home once more… As a man aches for his evening meal when all day long his brace of wine-dark oxen have dragged the bolted plowshare down a fallow field-how welcome the setting sun, the going home to supper, yes, though his knees buckle, struggling home at last.” (287 ll 31-38)

What is strange about the song’s epic simile and the book’s though, is that In the odyssey, the epic simile connects you to the situation, where you can relate to what Odysseus feels. However, in “Drops of Jupiter”, the epic simile takes to to a situation that is universal and something that makes the situation seem bigger, but nothing we can relate to. Overall the song and the Odyssey relate in many ways both with hero archetypal and in simile.

Carry on Wayward Son – By Sellers Thomas, Cole Clements, and Sam Richey

“Carry On Wayward Son”

Carry on my wayward son

There’ll be peace when you are done

Lay your weary head to rest

Don’t you cry no more

Ah

Once I rose above the noise and confusion

Just to get a glimpse beyond this illusion

I was soaring ever higher, but I flew too high

Though my eyes could see I still was a blind man

Though my mind could think I still was a mad man

I hear the voices when I’m dreaming,

I can hear them say

Carry on my wayward son,

There’ll be peace when you are done

Lay your weary head to rest

Don’t you cry no more

Masquerading as a man with a reason

My charade is the event of the season

And if I claim to be a wise man,

Well, it surely means that I don’t know

On a stormy sea of moving emotion

Tossed about, I’m like a ship on the ocean

I set a course for winds of fortune,

But I hear the voices say

Carry on my wayward son

There’ll be peace when you are done

Lay your weary head to rest

Don’t you cry no more no!

Carry on,

You will always remember

Carry on,

Nothing equals the splendor

Now your life’s no longer empty

Surely heaven waits for you

Carry on my wayward son

There’ll be peace when you are done

Lay your weary head to rest

Don’t you cry,

Don’t you cry no more,

No more!

Remarkable similarities exist between Homer’s epic poem The Odyssey and the song, Carry on my Wayward Son by Kansas. The lyric “carry on my wayward son, there’ll be peace when you are done,” is a message saying that if you push forward in difficult situations, you will be rewarded for doing so. The journey of Odysseus is very similar to this. He has to ‘carry on’ in the face of danger. He is also looking for a more tangible item, his home, where he can find peace. Another parallel between the song and The Odyssey is that the vocalist in the song is encouraging the hero to ‘carry on’. That is comparable to what Athena does for Odysseus. Besides asking for the gods to have pity on him, she also helps him formulate a course of action and motivates him (13.344-348).

Besides relating to Odysseus, the song also relates to Telemachus, Odysseus’ son. There are several examples of this. Both the “son” from the song and Telemachus are embarking on long, treacherous journeys. We don’t know what journey the character in the song is embarking on, but we know that Telemachus is setting sail to try to find his father (2.458-477). Furthermore, the part of the song that says, “on a stormy sea of moving emotion tossed about, I’m like a ship on the ocean” reflects the feelings of  Telemachus. He wants to be an honorable man like his father, he wants to kill the suitors that have taken over the family’s palace, and he wants his father to return home – all powerful emotions.  Lastly, the overall message of the song relates to Telemachus. “Carry on my wayward son” could be expressed for Telemachus as “Don’t give up hope of your father returning to Ithaca”. In conclusion, whether intentional or unintentional, the message of modern day bands sometimes relates back to the culture and entertainment of thousands of years ago.

“Kansas Lyrics “Carry on Wayward Son”” A-Z Lyrics. N.p., n.d. Web. <http://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/kansas/carryonwaywardson.html&gt;.

Homeward Bound- Simon and Garfunkel, By: Amir Razavi and Dylan Poynter

 

“Homeward Bound” by Simon and Garfunkel that obviously relates to the journey of the Odysseus, the main character of The Odyssey. This entire song pertains to the universal truth of nostos. Once the lyric is broken down, the relation of the song to the epic is evident. Many lines in this song describe the epic journey of Odysseus. Such lines include the line “On a tour of one night stands”, which can refer to the recurrent travel to another island. Another such line includes the phrase “Home, where my love lies waiting”, which can be reflective on the fact that Penelope lies waiting at Odysseus estate for Odysseus, her tenacious husband, to return. This could also be related to Odysseus, with the longing for his wife and son, which not only inflicts tenacity on his own mentality, but expedites his journey home; he is inspired by this dream of home. Lastly, “Tonight I’ll sing my songs again”, this verse tells us that Odysseus is tired of retelling his painful story of his past adventures and who he is each and every night, and that he simply wants to go back to his own comforting home.This song constantly reminds you of Odysseus’ long and difficult journey home, which is filled with unusual trials. In conclusion, “Homeward Bound” is a song that not only describes the Odysseus’ journey home, but his inner feelings too; such inner feelings include his longing for home, or his nostos. Odysseus conflicting journey is greatly described in this piece.

Homeward Bound by: Simon and Garfunkel

I’m sittin’ in the railway station

Got a ticket for my destination

On a tour of one night stands

My suitcase and guitar in hand

And every stop is neatly planned

For a poet and a one man band

 

Homeward bound

I wish I was

Homeward bound

Home, where my thought’s escaping

Home, where my music’s playing

Home, where my love lies waiting

Silently for me

 

Everyday’s an endless stream

Of cigarettes and magazines

And each town looks the same to me

The movies and the factories

And every stranger’s face I see

Reminds me that I long to be

 

Homeward bound

I wish I was

Homeward bound

Home, where my thought’s escaping

Home, where my music’s playing

Home, where my love lies waiting

Silently for me

 

Tonight I’ll sing my songs again

I’ll play the game and pretend

But all my words come back to me

In shades of mediocrity

Like emptiness in harmony

I need someone to comfort me

 

Homeward bound

I wish I was

Homeward bound

Home, where my thought’s escaping

Home, where my music’s playing

Home, where my love lies waiting

Silently for me

Silently for me

Silently for me

 

Source: “Homeward Bound Lyrics.” – Simon And Garfunkel. N.p., n.d. Web. 21 Oct. 2013.

 

Fortunate Son- Tommy and Pierce

         The song Fortunate Son by Creedance Clearwater Revival relates to The Odyssey in different ways. One way is that Odyesseus, who is a military man, has a boy named Telemachus who does not like violence. In the song it says “I ain’t no military son, no”. “I ain’t no fortunate one, no” Telemachus was born without a father which is pretty unfortunate. The song was trying to say that he is not a special kid and he does not have any special qualities. The songwriter is not very confident in himself and he is bringing himself down. He is being a hero by standing up for the people that are not rich or have any large amounts of money. For example he says “But when the taxman comes to the door, Lord the house looks like a rummage sale”. The mood is like fast and upbeat. There is strong guitar playing and a strong voice being used.

Some folks are born to wave the flag,
Ooh, they’re red, white and blue.
And when the band plays “Hail to the chief”,
Ooh, they point the cannon at you, Lord,

It ain’t me, it ain’t me, I ain’t no senator’s son, son.
It ain’t me, it ain’t me; I ain’t no fortunate one, no,
Yeah!

Some folks are born silver spoon in hand,
Lord, don’t they help themselves, oh.
But when the taxman comes to the door,
Lord, the house looks like a rummage sale, yes,

It ain’t me, it ain’t me, I ain’t no millionaire’s son, no.
It ain’t me, it ain’t me; I ain’t no fortunate one, no.

Some folks inherit star spangled eyes,
Ooh, they send you down to war, Lord,
And when you ask them, “How much should we give?”
Ooh, they only answer More! more! more! yoh,

It ain’t me, it ain’t me, I ain’t no military son, son.
It ain’t me, it ain’t me; I ain’t no fortunate one, one.
It ain’t me, it ain’t me, I ain’t no fortunate one, no no no,
It ain’t me, it ain’t me, I ain’t no fortunate son, no no no,

Freak, Lyrics. “Fortunate Son Lyrics.” – Creedence Clearwater Revival. Lyrics Freak, Spring 2013. Web. 22 Oct. 2013